What makes a good podcast? How about a great podcast? In this episode, Emily and Steve discuss the best ways to create a valuable message to grow your podcast audience as well as how companies should be approaching podcasting as a new form of content marketing. They also discuss emerging opportunities with audio content and voice assistants like Alexa, Google Assistant, and Siri.
Guest: JJ Ramberg is the co-founder of Goodpods, the new app where you can follow your friends, influencers, and favorite podcasters to see what they're listening to. JJ spent 13 years as an anchor on MSNBC and also co-founded the coupon site Goodshop.com. She is the author of two books -- the Wall Street Journal immediate bestseller, It's Your Business, and the children's book The Startup Club.
Intro: We all love a little “good” in our lives. In this episode, host Emily Binder and JJ dive into the optimism and simplicity that JJ’s app Goodpods offers to its users. The app provides users a way to give and get recommendations for podcasts from their friends and fellow users in a world where podcasting is becoming more and more popular.
Emily and JJ continue their conversation to discuss the ins and outs of building an app, making money, podcast advertising, the podcasts they’re loving right now, and more.
0:55: Meet JJ Ramberg
1:20: What is Goodpods?: Gravitating towards goodness.
“At its core, it’s just a way to find great new podcasts, and for podcasts to find new listeners.” - JJ Ramberg
3:45: Goodpods is Goodreads for podcasts. Download the app and claim your handle now. Follow @emilybinder and @JJ on Goodpods.
Co-founders and siblings, JJ and Ken Ramberg
5:00: The origins of Goodpods. JJ co-founded Goodpods with her brother Ken. They are both big podcast listeners.
“In 2019, 50% of the US population has at least listened to a podcast, and a third of them listen at least monthly.” Via Edison Research
6:05: These days, podcasting offers so much more than entertainment. More people are turning to podcasts for up to date news and information about what’s happening in the world, and sharing joy with those around them.
8:30: Podcasts are “low commitment.” You can consume information and entertainment more simply and easily. It’s a short-form content, and that’s the opposite of what we’re experiencing on social media.
9:20: Social media can be a negative space these days, linked to depression and addiction. But podcasting offers positivity, education, and entertainment.
10:21: Sharing podcast recommendations from the app: Ologies hosted by Alie Ward (check out the COVID-19 episode entitled Virology)
12:10 JJ loves Cool Mules podcast from CANADALAND and 10% Happier with Dan Harris
“These conversations are happening everywhere. We’ve just codified it, so you don’t have to remember them anymore.” - JJ Ramberg
15:55: Designing the Goodpods app: “We wanted it to be familiar” - JJ Ramberg
16:50: Beta testing: Goodpods is constantly adopting the app to be as simple and user friendly as possible.
17:01: So how does Goodpods make money? As a listener, a lot of people fast forward through ads. Is podcast advertising in a good place? Is it effective?
19:00 Podcast advertising is going to change in the coming years. Emily recommends: Six Pixels of Separation #700 – Seth Godin on Podcasting
“It’s not about how many people are listening, but what is the quality of the audience. Are they interested in a really niche topic? Because this medium lets you get so niche.”
21:20: Discussing parasocial relationships. Why do we sometimes feel like we are friends with podcasters, tv characters, etc.?
22:00: Growing podcast viewership is often the number one goal or metric for a podcaster. What is the best way to promote a new or existing podcast?
23:58: Emily and JJ discuss “Calls to Action,” or CTAs. It’s tough to get a reaction sometimes; you have to make things as easy as possible for the listener.
25:20: There are 800,000 podcasts. Don’t try to compete with the top podcasts on the charts, compete within your niche, and build the target audience for your specific brand.
“We weren't trying to be everything to everybody. We were just trying to be what we’re supposed to be for our audience.” - JJ Ramberg
28:38: JJ’s podcast recommendations: WeCrashed, a podcast about the rise and fall of WeWork, and the Ten Percent Happier Podcast with Dan Harris.
Goodpods is always looking for feedback and suggestions for their app. If you would like to submit a comment or suggestion, email JJ at jj (at) goodpods (dot) com.
Goodpods Co-Founder JJ Ramberg
The Southeast Asian region’s internet economy has hit a key milestone, reaching $100 billion in market capitalization for the first time in 2019. This represents a 39% increase from the previous year. Money is moving in and out of this region in ways never before seen.
Audrey Hall is SVP, Product and Marketing at Brightwell, one of Atlanta’s fastest growing fintech companies
Audrey and Emily talked about Audrey’s mission at Brightwell, a payments technology company whose fintech solutions serve seafarers on the world’s major cruise Iines including Carnival, Norwegian, and more. We talked about the war on cash in the US and abroad, combatting fraud, and how Brightwell approaches educating users who are mostly unbanked or underbanked. Plus, the relationship between product and marketing.
is SVP of Product and Marketing at Brightwell, where she is focused on building financial products that transform global workers’ lives. Previously, Audrey served as VP of Client Strategy at 352, Inc.
“Our purpose really is to help these underbanked, underserved communities who deserve the same access to the tools that we all have. That they are included in this financial world where You can have your dreams be possible by savings, by thinking about budgeting.” - Audrey Hall
1:39 Meet Emily’s guest, Audrey Hall
2:05: What does Brightwell do?
2:34: Brightwell is a fintech company out of Atlanta. They create financial technology products that serve the specific needs of migrant workers. Strong focus in the maritime industry. They help people send money home to their families and join the digital economy. Digital and financial inclusion.
“When we looked at payments in the cruise industry, it was kind of archaic.”
3:24: On-ship payroll payments are often done in cash. It’s risky and not cost-efficient. Brightwell offers a solution and serves people from 140 different countries around the world.
4:50: Brightwell’s clients include seafarers on cruise lines such as Norwegian, Carnival, Princess, Aida, Costa and more.
“The digital economy at large is something we’ve come to expect in the Western world.” - Audrey Hall
5:50: 2 billion people today are unbanked globally
6:05: These users offer tremendous opportunities for financial and corporate expansion, but their needs are unique and are impacted by language barriers, B2C interactions, education levels, and more
6:50: Build trust and empathy with various user groups
7:55: How do ATMs play a part in all this? ATM use is complicated and sometimes risky.
8:50: People are drawn to hard currency and the physicality of cash. Brightwell tries to help users understand why digital funds can be safer for them and their families, while respecting the ways that cash is still important for certain use cases and cultures.
9:25: Countries like Sweden are going cashless. 30% of Americans don’t use any cash in a given week.
9:40: Cash vs Digital. What are the pros and cons of each? How do you manage risk?
11:00: We’re more hesitant to offer up personal information (especially PII) these days. Companies like Brightwell work hard to ensure digital users are protected but fraud is rampant.
12:30: Real talk: Fraud can impact user experience and brand reputation. How do you deal with that?
“It’s something we will continue to iterate on and find new ways to educate users on.” “Yeah they are going to blame us, but it’s our responsibility to take care of them and make their experience the best it can be.” - Audrey Hall
14:34: Companies should be the guide, not the hero. Base your marketing and messaging around this guiding principle. It’s all about servicing the person who is using your product.
Each person who works at Brightwell is bought into their core principle and aims to put the user experience first.
15:05: Brightwell’s core principle: user first.
16:50: What is the difference between unbanked and underbanked? In the U.S. there are 55 million unbanked individuals
17:37: People depend on cash and keeping those systems in place is equally important as educating them on digital banking services.
18:19: How has Brightwell transformed itself in the last few years? Adopting more of a startup mindset.
19:20: Product testing: Brightwell works to understand the language and flow that would resonate most with clients based on their one-on-one user experience testing on prototypes (e.g. payment app Brightwell Navigator on Android and iOS)
19:50: “Focus groups are not your friend!”
21:17: Your product and marketing departments should be in constant communication. It will help you find the “why” behind your products. Collaboration is key.
22:00: What’s next for Brightwell and Audrey?
23:23: Brightwell is launching in the Philippines this year with a physical location.
26:00: Each year Brightwell is iterating and growing. Everyone there is committed to the purpose of the organization.
Audrey’s podcast recommendations: Reply All podcast episode 102 “Long Distance” and 103 “Long Distance, Part II.” It focuses on fraudsters like tech support scams based, suspicious callers, etc, and takes you behind the scenes as they track down an Indian call center that is scamming people.
Connect with Audrey Hall on LinkedIn and Twitter: @ansianko
Learn more about Brightwell and follow @BrightwellApp on social.
Alison Greenberg is a naming expert, brand strategist, and verbal designer. As of 2023 Alison is the Co-Founder and CEO at RuthHealth. Previously she was Co-Founder and CEO of aflow, a conversational AI studio designing and building AI-powered, NLP-backed chat and voice assistant experiences. Over the past 12+ years, she's helped brands find their voice in the marketplace.
Alison’s branding and naming work includes brands + agencies: McCann, VSA Partners, Siegelvision, Elmwood, OpenIDEO, Edwards Lifesciences, Stryker, Summit Health/City MD, Pfizer, General Motors, McDonald's, Hungryroot, The Helm, Fidelity, Llamasoft + others. (Alison Greenberg- LinkedIn.)
Alison Greenberg, Co-Founder & CEO of RuthHealth, and brand naming expert and strategist. Twitter: @ALiS0NLAURA
Emily spoke with Alison about her approach to naming products and brands with a few great examples from fashion to CBD. Plus, should voice assistants have a gender? And what makes a good chatbot?
This episode has good old fashioned branding, voice and conversation design (VUI), startups and women creating cool products for women, and the keys to designing a great chat experience for your customers or audience.
1:50: Alison shares her background and how she became involved with naming brands.
2:15: Language is a currency and in any form of advertising, marketing, or branding it is the core piece of the craft. Naming is the most condensed way to apply language to a brand. Naming is the way that you take language and really put it to work for the brand it’s poetry, but it’s also a strategic execution of ideas.
3:35: Naming can be subjective, so how do you objectively define the success of a name?
3:50: You can’t decouple a name from what it represents. The naming doesn’t happen in a vacuum, but the success of a brand is mostly qualitative. Is it succinct? Does it telegraph meaning?
5:20: Successful names often stop us in our tracks. In B2B naming you don’t have much of an opportunity to do that, but it’s becoming easier to be creative and innovative with naming.
6:00: Slack is a great example of this. It resonates with the user. People often say “slack it to me” or “slack me.” It’s simple and surprising: two criteria for a great name.
6:55: There’s a science behind why names with harder consonants such as k and z. Experts in linguistics study sound symbolism, phonosemantics, and phonaesthesia: the idea that the way a word sounds have lexical meaning and meaning in the way that they sound. It’s all about the relationship between sound and meaning.
'Phonaesthesia occurs when certain sounds become associated with certain meanings, even though they do not attempt to imitate the sound (as in onomatopoeia). ' 'Phonaesthesia has been described as a type of conventional sound symbolism.
Women in Voice is building community for women in this new technology space. Alison is chapter founder of Women in Voice NY.
9:11: Often, brands run into legal problems when trying to establish a name to their brand. One such company that Alison worked with is Where Mountains Meet. Brand owners approached Alison after being hit with a cease and desist letter for the brand name they were originally using when launching their sustainable women’s clothing business. See more about Where Mountains Meet on their Instagram.
11:05: calmbound is another female-owned business that Alison has worked with whose owners had a passion for language and creating a brand of CBD edibles curated with the proper dosage of CBD and available to people of all walks of life, i.e. veterans, elderly, etc. calmbound echoes the literal compound used in CBD, but also has a deeper meaning that resonates with the brand’s hope that users would be “calm bound” with their mental and physical health. See more about calmbound.
12:45: There is always a need for naming. Whether it’s podcasts or brands, the ability to be clear as well as memorable is a true art. -Alison Greenberg
14:25: Some of the most interesting perspectives can come from an intersectional and diverse background. When we’re thinking about voice, having a background in understanding the human element and how language and communication function on a level with human emotion is really helpful.
15:30: Being brief and getting your message across concisely is key. Brevity goes beyond just the way you look at brand communication. It has to be done visually and verbally because we are constantly being bombarded with information.
17:15: You don’t have a lot of real estate with voice. You have to use as few words as possible to get your message across.
Voice User Interfaces (VUI) are the primary or supplementary visual, auditory, and tactile interfaces that enable voice interaction between people and devices. A VUI can be anything from a light that blinks when it hears your voice to an car’s entertainment console.
18:34: When you’re building a custom voice experience responding in the fewest amount of words while maintaining a personality and conversational flow is a balance that you have to strike.
19:00: How do you bake the tone of the brand into pre-programmed chat responses while maintaining brevity?
19:19: You need to remove the formalities and just focus on conversation with chat. Telegraph meaning and utility. The whole point of a chatbot is to get something accomplished. -Alison Greenberg
20:35: Make sure that your chatbot voice is honoring that brand. A beauty brand might use emojis while an insurance brand would be establishing trust.
22:10: Bots and voice should use language to be solution creators, not just problem solvers.
23:10: Make it known that a chatbot is being used from the beginning. The BOT bill (Senate bill 1001) in California makes it illegal for bots to pretend to be humans online.
24:30: Considering gender with virtual assistants: The term virtual assistant is a better term for a chatbot. Using the first person plural can be a good way to stay gender-neutral.
25:40: There is no reason to give a bot a gender unless it’s strategic. For example, the brand Swoobie’s target customer is a female, so it makes sense for their voice and chatbot to take a female gender. In financial services, it doesn’t matter.
27:45: Staying gender-neutral with voice can be tricky.
28:48: Female topics can often be taboo, but some brands in femtech and sextech are starting the conversation around them: Lola, Cora, etc. Chatbots allow for these topics on women’s healthcare to be explored in an environment that feels safe and non-judgmental.
30:21: Book recommendation: Questions of negotiation are really common in the voice industry, especially for women. Alison recommends “Getting More” by Stuart Diamond.
Jason Fields, Chief Strategy Officer, Voicify
Jason Fields is Chief Strategy Officer at Voicify, a top CMS (content management system) for designing voice experiences on Alexa and Google Assistant. Jason and Emily discussed the meaning of multimodal design for voice assistants and why this kind of conversation design matters. How can brands create experiences for customers to interact with a voice assistant from different devices with varying screen sizes or no screen at all? It’s all about context.
Overall, the question becomes: How do we connect and organize a variety of communicable assets in a way that meets basic (and reasonable) audience expectations? Jason and Voicify have created a free downloadable guide about modality for brands.
Amazon Echo Show 5 - an entry level multimodal smart speaker (voice + visual)
Multimodality in voice experiences
Johnnie Walker tasting Alexa skill - good example
Saucony is doing a nice job in audio responses and visual components with emotive vs instructive images in specific parts of the conversation (this is sensitivity to multimodality)
Images should match the conversation tone (e.g. a dispassionate conversation about product features should be accompanied by a feature set image, not models wearing the product out in the world)
“How do I get to your store?” should show a map - seems obvious but isn’t being done often enough
Use case for multimodal experiences: a woman getting ready for a flight. The experience could contain or present information to assist customer with: packing, organizing, car service, check flight time, traffic, terminal location, gate, TSA status, etc. - all the devices information can be displayed should take advantage of screen space and contextual data such as location.
Voicify can detect type of voice assistant device (such as Echo Auto or smart TV or mobile phone or smart watch) and respond appropriately based on context and device, even offering secondary information such as gate update
Key: suss out what information is most useful to user at that moment and how best to present it visually and with sound: first, map user intention
Brands have been assembling digital assets for twenty years: we have vast libraries so it should be simple to assign a framework to these assets
Jason’s podcast recommendation: Armchair Expert with Dax Shepard
Twitter: @Voicify
How can brands use sound to connect with customers? As voice technology becomes embedded in consumers’ lives, the sound of your brand will be increasingly important.
What should your brand sound like on Alexa? Because this is a transitional moment in voice technology, right now there is a real opportunity to be an early adopter, especially for a vertical like FMCG (fast moving consumer goods) as we expect an $80 billion voice commerce market by 2023.
Bottom line, this is about using sound to connect with customers and strengthen your consistent brand voice.
Guest: Designed in Italy and assembled in Germany, Michele Arnese is a self-driven strategic and creative thinker with a strong entrepreneurial approach. As Global CEO and Creative Director of amp, in the field of audio branding, he's considered one of the world's foremost experts, with clients including Mastercard, Mercedes, Porsche, BBVA, Geberit, BMW, UniCredit, MINI, Triumph, The Linde Group and a range of international awards for his work with amp.
Sound DNA by amp
03:00 Michele’s story from management consulting and music to founding amp a decade ago
04:10 Why sonic branding matters. First: think of James Bond as a sonic identity: this is key to the elevator pitch to convince clients of the importance of sonic branding. Close your eyes and listen to Shirley Bassey or Adele. You can see James Bond in your mind.
05:30 Sonic DNA: a core track or melody that translates to all different brand touch points such as video, commercials, transaction sounds
06:00 Sonic logo has been around a long time (famous examples include Intel and T-Mobile). Sonic DNA is a new idea: it’s about ingredients, you can combine differently to create different sonic assets for different touch points (like James Bond has different sounds for Skyfall or other editions).
07:00 Sonic branding must be more flexible and complex than just a jingle
07:15 Mastercard client work: a melody approach to the sonic DNA then developing music for very different touch points including audio visual and digital channels plus global campaigns like 2019 where we did a sonic watermark.
07:50 MasterCard New York restaurant watermark for different soundscapes
08:00 Flexibility and recognition is the payoff for sonic branding, the ROI essentially
08:15 Budget for visual brand identity with logos (think of Gap or Tropicana logo rebrands) - why don’t we question this but in sonic branding it is harder to get budget
09:00 Music is an old connection to humans (in our brains) but a new discipline for brand strategy. Brands must break through clutter. Voice assistants like Alexa and voice tech introduce an awareness for the need to be recognized in a non-visual environment.
09:40 ROI of sonic branding - amp client UniCredit’s study: client had savings in terms of music production budget and licenses and AV production (able to begin with owned material)
“The Sound of BBVA: Bringing the age of opportunity to everyone. Using the BBVA sound DNA, we developed a holistic audio identity covering all digital and physical spaces. This sonic branding project stands above and beyond the rest, serving as a benchmark for future audio branding projects.” Case study: amp - BBVA’s sonic branding
11:10 We process sound and music in the limbic system, same place brain stores emotion - this where brands want to be processed, too
11:30:
There are a lot of studies that explain the brain statistics, but if you go back to yourself, to your experience: what counts is the association that you get with the brand and the sonic ecosystem. - Michele Arnese
12:00 Michele’s research process to create a sonic mood board through immersion (example: he walks through retail store and listens)
12:30:
We create a new dimension of a brand identity. - Michele Arnese
13:00 Some of amp’s clients are in banking and financial services, also many in auto industry and FMCG
13:30 His financial sector work began with UniCredit then BBVA - this sector had a need for greater human connection between brand and customers
THE SOUND OF PORSCHE. AN ENTIRELY NEW, INTERACTIVE BRAND EXPERIENCE.
“Tasked to create an audio branding concept for the Porsche sound lab, we created an interactive sound installation featuring soundscapes and video mapping techniques.” - amp
13:50: Some banking and financial brands realized that the human connection was missing and music could help. This is why we have seen an explosion of cases [for sonic branding] in the financial industry. - Michele
14:20 Financial services is changing greatly in last five years: fewer branches and physical location, but need to instill trust and physical security. Must compensate for changing landscape of brand experience with something that can establish the connection like music.
15:20 What is the function of the Mastercard Acceptance sound (the sound indicating that payment is successful)?
15:50 Acceptance sound for credit card company is to 1) establish trust and 2) reiterate brand recognition
16:30 How does a brand apply sonic branding to voice as with Alexa or Google Assistant? Understand the translation of the brand into sonic attributes.
17:00 How to create a voice profile for a brand (attributes such as introverted or extroverted must be heard in the brand voice)
18:10 Alexa Skills for a brand: sound and voice can join together
19:10 Understand the North Star of a brand - sonic branding helps examine this
20:00 There is a set of feelings, tonalities, impacts which must be the same for the entire brand. Define the borders. Consistency is key.
20:30 How will conversation between brand and consumers change as voice assistants have greater impact on marketing and consumer touch points?
21:00 “We have said that brands are dying on Alexa. But now there is a journey for brands to get back to more connection in creating, for example, voice avatars.”
21:45 We are in a transition phase regarding branded voice experiences
22:00 Brands who’ve done their homework will succeed in voice - establishing sonic branding is first step
22:30 Opportunity exists to be first brand to define acoustic domain in many sectors: look at FMCG, blue ocean here (with $80 billion voice commerce market in 2023, fast moving consumer goods can take advantage and be first movers with sound branding)
25:00 Music Journalism Insider: News, job listings, and interviews from the world of music journalism. Edited by Todd L. Burns.
Drawing on the findings of the Best Audio Brands Ranking, Michele Arnese discusses with Paul Armstrong in an interview for Forbes what it takes to create a killer sonic brand that delivers and delves into the implications for big and small companies. - These Are the World’s Best Sonic Brands by Paul Armstrong, Forbes
Twitter: @brandingamp
What is the future of AI and voice in financial services, and why does this technology matter? Amit Dogra is the Chief Experience Officer at Sanctuary Wealth, which reached $10bn in AUA (assets under advisement) within 15 months after its 2018 founding. Sanctuary is a partner owned firm that brings together an elite group of wealth advisors under the banner of partnered independence.
Amit and Emily Binder talked about Sanctuary's unveiling of their Alexa Skills and what it means for their business. Voice is symbolic of more than just embracing new technology.
03:15 Sanctuary Wealth’s focus on anti-Wall Street and anti-big bank culture, more intimate and partner-oriented: #PartneredIndependence - here’s a video from CEO Jim Dickson about partnered independence
03:45 What does a Chief Experience Officer (CXO) do? He focuses on culture, growth, and innovation.
03:50 How does a Wall Street M.O. cause client experience to suffer? It’s results-driven instead of client-centric.
Amit Dogra unveils Sanctuary Wealth’s Alexa Skills at Oasis 2019
04:15 Creating fictitious bank accounts to hit numbers (you know who) - and the corporate culture that drove this
05:15 Amazon as the ultra customer-centric company
06:30 Sanctuary Wealth’s Alexa Skill announcement in fall 2019 at Oasis: What is Amit’s team doing with voice, and why was this initiative important? Who benefits?
07:28 The audience for their Alexa Skill is both B2B and B2C: there’s corporate and internal use and also advisor to end client
09:45 If I’m a Sanctuary advisor, how do I use the Alexa Skill? Functions include internal phone/directory, corporate contact information, and archives of the monthly all-hands call (“Alexa, play Sanctuary Wealth corporate update”).
11:15 Looking at Echo devices for video calling features, Amit is excited about the Echo Show for multimodal (they deployed on the Echo Show 5, passing up the Dot because the video feature was key)
12:15 Emily: Echo Dot was successful as an affordable entry level smart speaker. Great for habit formation. But today screenless Dots or Google Home Minis aren’t as popular as multimodal voice assistant devices because people want a screen for visuals.
13:10 Results so far: adoption and useful feedback
Sanctuary Wealth unveiled personalized Alexa devices for their advisors (tweet)
14:50 New habit formation
15:30 “Advisors are leaving wirehouses and the banking industry because they’re tired of the past. But we have to give them a reason to stay with us. Doing things differently by embracing tech is key.” - Amit
16:15 You have to spell out and educate with voice at first
16:30 Voice hits the limbic system (this emotional processing center happens to also be where we store music and memory) - and we all know that money is emotional
17:35 What does Amit see happening with AI and technology in financial services and the RIA space in the next two years?
18:13 You can’t imagine the business will be static. AI will be embraced but not as quickly in financial services as other industries.
We want to be the early adopter because this is a copycat industry. -Amit Dogra
19:10 AI can change the financial services game like analytics changed baseball - as far as interaction with clients and doing business in a better way
20:10 Bonus question: What is Amit’s opinion on Jeff Bezos as a CEO?
23:00 The best podcast Amit has heard lately: Everything is Alive hosted by Ian Chillag
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